No news.. Good news?

I told a person in another forum that I’d post something on the Rachel Corrie affair, about which they were interested in continuing a debate. But truth be told, most everything I’ve wanted to say on the subject I said many years ago in a piece that can be found here. So I’m going to leave it there and if a debate over the matter must continue, so be it. The comments section awaits.

In the meantime, a quick update on the co-op front. The best news is that there’s been no news since Sacramento joined Port Townsend and many other co-ops before them in a long line of stores that have rejected calls to boycott Israeli goods. I had it on pretty good authority that the Olympian BDS group was working to export their boycott “revolution” to 4-5 other co-ops in the Northwest, but have heard nothing concrete regarding any subsequent boycott-related activity since then.

Now it may be that these things just take time to percolate through an organization, although I suspect that the BDSers are beginning to realize what a weapon they have handed their opponents who can simply contrast the thoughtful and public debate at co-ops that have said no to boycott (which resulted in zero controversy within the organization) vs. Olympia where a less-than-open process (to put in mildly) has led to disunity and chaos.

And speaking of Olympia, the local BDS group recently tried to throw what I refer to as a “long bomb” (the football, not the military term) in response to having been put on the defensive in recent weeks. Their “Open Letter to Boycott Opponents” combines every self-congratulatory trope (we’re peaceful, we fight oppression, we are globally significant) with a long list of accusations against their opponents (i.e., their neighbors) as being uncivil, dishonest bullies, a finger-wagging diatribe that only pointed out their desperation to regain the role of prosecutor, judge and victim.

Fortunately, local anti-boycott activists did not rise to the bait and a debate over the Open Letter (to which I contributed) got shut down when the kitchen got too hot. It’s actually been more interesting to observe discussions where outsiders such as me did not distort things by becoming lightning rod. To site just one example, in this discussion (which includes a number of people highly critical of arguments made in this blog) boycott supporters are realizing that upcoming co-op elections may be decided based not on who is the best candidate to deal with the broad array of needs of the organization, but based instead on where people stand on one issue: the Israel boycott.

Add to this distortion the fact that the organization must now bring in paid mediators to help deal with divisions between the membership and between the staff over this issue and you begin to get the impression that even vocal boycott supporters are starting to realize the true costs of giving local BDSers bragging rights at everyone else’s expense.

On a purely strategic level, Olympia continuing to suffer and act as a shining example of what not to do is probably the best asset for me and my fellow anti-BDSers. But having gotten to know a number of locals who are POed about this decision beyond belief, I can’t bring myself to just think about this community strategically. These are real people who have put up for far too long with others in the community assuming they shared the exact same opinions in the Middle East (or of assuming Israel supporters are too cowed to buck incessant provocations on the matter). But as with so many communities, the red line gets drawn at BDS. And the local boycotters are just now discovering what happens when that line has been crossed.

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29 Responses to No news.. Good news?

  1. Anonymous October 18, 2010 at 3:21 am #

    Excellent piece on 60 Minutes regarding the story of the “archaeologic” digging in East Jerusalem. Two pristine examples of ridiculous Zionist narratives. First, by an official of the Elad Settler Movement who is justifying Jewish settlements in east Jerusalem because “Abraham was here 600 years prior to Mohammed” , “the Muslims have Mecca &Medina”, “if we can buy Arab homes in east jerusalem and settle with Jews we will do it”. Then comes the mayor of Jerusalem, (Barkat) , who justifies the demolition of 22 Arab homes to be replaced with “jewish tourism”, on the basis that the Arab homes were built illegally.

    These 2 men have no interest in a 2 state solution and resulting peace AND the necessary compromises. Neither does Netanyahu or
    settler/thug Lieberman. They all have one goal, and one goal only, and that is
    to advance the Zionist dream. In this dream there is no room for the Arabs,
    unless as some subservient and inferior in an apartheid state. The world is seeing all of this with increasing frequency and clarity (thanks to the near instant dissemination of “on the ground” information in the form of news,
    photos, and videos) and will not accept it.

    Next time posters here (e.g. DrMike) bash the proponents of a one state solution think about this: Israel is working hard at destroying all other alternatives.

    No justice = no peace

  2. Anonymous October 18, 2010 at 3:53 am #

    A delegation of The Elders headed by Mary Robinson, first women president of Ireland ( those damn Irish are nothing but trouble for Israel) heads to gaza and states “continuation of Gaza blockade is the shame of the world”. The Elders include two South Africans, Mandela and Tutu, anti apartheid human rights activists.

  3. Anonymous October 18, 2010 at 4:07 am #

    Jon can you please further elaborate on 2 statements you made:

    ” …shared the exact same opinions in the Middle East”. What exactly are these “opinions”?

    “the local boycotters are just now discovering what happens when that red line is crossesd”. What exactly happens when the red line is crossed? You have inside information.

  4. Jon October 18, 2010 at 1:49 pm #

    Would that be the same Mary Robinson who refused to address the Irish Trade Union's Congress because of it's threatened BDS stance? (Just asking…)

    Regarding the “exact same opinions,” those would be the opinions you and your colleagues share regarding who is right and who is wrong in the Middle East, opinions reflected in the endless graffiti you post on countless blogs (regardless of their relevance to any subject under discussion).

    Olympia simply takes this groupthink beyond cyberspace, erecting murals and implementing boycotts under the assumption that everyone in town is already in total agreement with the BDS-minded world view or is too cowed to say anything if they disagree.

    Regarding what happens when red lines are crossed: the worst nightmare of any BDSer – people with differing opinions finding their voice and taking democratic action (oh, the horror!) I know it can be pretty frightening when people with whom you disagree join the ranks of the politically active, but those are the breaks in a society where more than just your opinion is allowed to flourish.

  5. Fred October 18, 2010 at 3:24 pm #

    With your Zionist, right wing and Israel centric glasses on all you see in Robinson's is another anti Israeli person who should be discredited (your blind bias against her is guised by your statement that she refusal to address a union). Take those glasses off and maybe you will see more.

  6. Jon October 18, 2010 at 4:47 pm #

    Dear Fred – I simply pointed out that Mary Robinson (who was presented as someone whose criticisms of Israel we should all respect due to her status as an “Elder”) is also highly critical of BDS. If pointing out such a fact gets you hot under the collar, you should have words with the anonymous poster who brought Robinson up in the first place.

    As an aside, while I avoid using terminology such as “right wing” and “left wing” myself, if you are going to use this vocabulary I recommend you apply the term “right wing” to the side in this debate which is allied with the world's most racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary,, totalitarian regimes on the face of the earth. But (as with so many things) this would involve you having a conversation with a mirror, rather than with me.

  7. Anonymous October 18, 2010 at 8:41 pm #

    anonymous –
    “Next time posters here (e.g. DrMike) bash the proponents of a one state solution think about this: Israel is working hard at destroying all other alternatives.”

    can you give me an example where the palestinian side (yes, there are TWO sides to the conflict) ever accepted the idea of TWO states?
    I'll make it easier for you. no, never. Blaming only Israel for the conflict just because we don't want to give up land for nothing, even though Hamas and Abbas claim that a jewish state in Israel is not accepted (because of religious reasons. read about “dhimmis”) is pure Antisemitism. yes. Claiming that jews want the land for themselves because they are jewish and so they deserve it (?!)(there are a few religious freaks in every country. They don't represent anything. And 22 families were deported because they built their homes ILLEGALY, just like I can't wake up tomorrow and build a house without permission) is simply Antisemitism (and I really don't like to use this word. you made me do that) or complete ignorance.

  8. Anonymous October 19, 2010 at 12:27 am #

    Building to destroy the peace process

    The only explanation for the government's approval of 240 new housing units in East Jerusalem is that it was an attempt to sabotage the efforts to renew direct peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians.

    http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/opinion/building-to-destroy-the-peace-process-1.319690

  9. DrMike October 19, 2010 at 12:42 am #

    my goodness, miss a few days and all the Anons out there want a piece of me!

    The charge that Israel is making a 2 state solution impossible is both ludicrous in the context of discussing BDS (given that BDS completely opposes that– and you don't have to take my word for it, listen to Omar Barghouti and other BDS leaders tell you: http://www.youtube.com/user/standwithus#p/u/4/ifZLk6Ei9-U) and it's also false given history: Israel evacuated settlers from Sinai and from Gaza. Politically will evacuating West Bank settlements be more difficult? Sure. But in exchange for actual peace the overwhelming majority of Israelis will support it.
    Speaking of peace, when was it that the Palestinian leadership agreed to give up the fictitious “right” of return? Only when the Palestinians accept that THEIR “right of return” will only be to Ramallah, Nablus and Jenin and not Tel Aviv and Haifa (and the Israelis will of course have to cede THEIR “right of return” to places like Hebron)can there be peace. Otherwise it's just granting the rejectionists a forward base to attack Israel. That's not something for which Israel should be making any concessions.

    By the way, the one success BDS can claim for itself: it has united Zionists from left to right! New Israel Fund and J Street working together with StandWithUs (http://stopbdsnow.blogspot.com/)! This type of unity usually only occurs when Israel's very existence is under attack–oh right, almost forgot– that IS the point of BDS.

  10. DrBig October 19, 2010 at 4:20 am #

    Israeli soldier to serve a 5 month jail term for stealing from flotilla activists, but no soldier is sentenced for killing 9 civilians in international waters. Got to love it ….Israeli justice at it's best.

  11. Anonymous October 19, 2010 at 4:36 am #

    “The sole purpose of non Jews is to serve jews”

    Ovadia Yosef spiritual leader of Shas and ex chief rabbi of Israel

    Another bigot?

  12. DrMike October 19, 2010 at 5:56 am #

    Indeed, he is– a world class religious bigot. It looks like Muslim religious leaders (you remember, the ones who call Jews “the sons of apes and pigs”) and Christian ones (the whack job in Florida that wanted to burn the Koran, the anti-gay preacher who got caught with a Rent-Boy, or Jeremiah Wright claiming HIV was a government plot against African Americans)don't have a monopoly on bigotry or idiocy.
    Interestingly enough, Yosef also supports the peace process, which is more than you can say for many other bigots.
    And this is your justification for BDS against Israel– and only against Israel? That's so thin it qualifies as anorexic.

  13. Anonymous October 19, 2010 at 7:10 pm #

    More Lip service from the Zionist pit bull DrMike. Your tactic of defending Israel by attacking any person, country or organization that criticizes Israel is getting old.

    For decades now (long before there was any BDS movement) Israel has said one thing and done another. I am sorry but actions speak much louder than words. When Israel says it wants two states for two peoples on the one hand, but builds settlements on the same land that is to be a Palestinian state, that is theft and lying. Israel has always preferred land to peace. Here are some quotes from Israel's leaders:

    “Everybody has to move, run and grab as many (Palestinian) hilltops as they can to enlarge the (Jewish) settlements because everything we take now will stay ours…Everything we don't grab will go to them.”

    — Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of the Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, Nov. 15, 1998.

    “The settlement of the Land of Israel is the essence of Zionism. Without settlement, we will not fulfill Zionism. It's that simple.”
    — Yitzhak Shamir, Maariv, 02/21/1997.

    “It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism, colonialization, or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands.”
    — Ariel Sharon, Israeli Foreign Minister, addressing a meeting of militants from the extreme right-wing Tsomet Party, Agence France Presse, November 15, 1998.

    So DrMike do yourself a favor and stop lying about Israel's intentions. These quotes are not mine they are documented comments from Israel's leadership.

    With regards to Gaza: In 2005 approximately 7,000 settlers wee evacuated from Gaza. Since 2005 the settler population has increased by alost 75,000. So much for Israel's efforts to reduce the settler population.

  14. Fred October 19, 2010 at 7:22 pm #

    DrMike The non Jewish religious nut cases you have correctly identified are just that: bigots on the fringes. However, they are not the “chief pastor” of their nation nor are they the “spiritual leader” of a political party. Ooops I forgot religion and politics coexist in democratic Israel. I thought church and state should stay apart in a democracy? Who cares, this is the land of the chosen people and they can do anything they desire.

  15. Jon October 19, 2010 at 9:49 pm #

    Fred – You seem confused. For it is in your beloved Gaza that the Koran is serving as the constitution and that religious fanaticism is the ticket to political power, which is why Christians are fleeing the region, as they are fleeing from the many, many lands where “religious nut cases” (as you refer to them) hold power.

    What a pity that these places cannot allow religious pluralism to flourish, where fantaticism would have no home, where the ballot would overwhelm the bullet. But, then again, that means those places would look a hell of a lot more like Israel (yes! dreaded Israel – the object of your ire and the subject of your endless, irrelevant graffiti) than they would look like any of Israel's many, many neighbors where religious bigots vie with secular totalitarians for (1) who can brutalize their people the most and (2) who can (like you) project all of their own faults onto the Jewish state.

    Let me know if I missed anything.

  16. Fred October 20, 2010 at 3:01 am #

    Jon I never said the Arab nations are democracies. What I take exception to is asshole Israel apologists like you who want to portray Israel as a democracy which it is not (see post above for just one example).

    Many of these Arab nations are US puppets that serve our interests. The question I have is why does the US insist on supporting a nation that is increasingly a liability for us. Take a look at the US congress, the Israel lobby and you will find many of the answers.

    Long before there was a Hamas organization (established in 1987) Israel occupied and oppressed the Palestinians. Just wondering when a people are occupied, oppressed, and treated like animals, could that breed anger,
    frustration, resentment, and cowardly acts of terrorism? I know that is above your pay grade and IQ but give it a try.

  17. Anonymous October 20, 2010 at 3:15 am #

    Jon what do you think of Christine O'Donnell? She sounds like she is right up your alley: doesn't understand separation of state and church, a reactionary, a republican, the list goes on……

  18. Jon October 20, 2010 at 10:57 am #

    Anon – How many times do I have to point out that it is you and your cause that is proudly allied with the most racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary, totalitarian regimes on the face of the earth?

    Once again, I think you and your fellow anonymous posters need to take a good look in the mirror, or maybe form some sort of group therapy organization in which you can work out why you project all of your own faults and characteristics onto others, just as your project all of the sins of Israel's foes onto Israel itself.

  19. Anonymous October 20, 2010 at 5:56 pm #

    Fred, I won't commend to all of your nonsence simply because there is no use telling FACTS to someone who seeks to ignore them. but still-

    a. PLO (A terror organization just like Hamas) was established in 1964 (yes, before the “occupation” in 1967)
    http://lexicorient.com/e.o/plo.htm
    Terror against jews living in Israel started in 1920. please learn history instead of rewriting it.
    b. you decide that the jewish dream is to “occupy”. I think that your dream is swimming with dolphins. same logic – none. The jewish “dream” is to live safely in our justified homeland (the “amount” of land is not important, no matter if you quote few extreme religious people who represent nothing), and the other side (yes, there are TWO sides to the story!) don't accept our right to live in Israel, no matter where, based on religious view. But you don't bother to even know historical facts, so I won't bother you with Quotes of the palestinian leaders who call for killing all jews abroad, and first in Israel. I wish I could ignore reality like you and decide that jews “steal” land simply because they are evil, must be fun.

  20. Anonymous October 20, 2010 at 8:22 pm #

    Jon you can repeat your statements as many times as you wish and until you are blue in the face, I won't buy them as I don't buy lies.

    The BDS movement has many supporters in the US, Britain, France, Holland, Norway,… the list goes on. I was not aware that these states were the “most racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary, totalitarian regimes on the face of the earth”.

    Unless you think anyone who supports the BDS movement is just “racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary, totalitarian” which puts you right back in the company you belong: bigots.

  21. Jon October 21, 2010 at 7:48 am #

    You are under the mistaken impression that I have any interest or see any point in getting you to “buy into” anything. Your lifelong commitment to Palestinian Hasbarah, after all, leaves you impervious to any argument, any fact, anything at all that might contradict your eternally fixed political positions. And your readiness to project all of your own faults onto others means your contribution to any debate will always be limited to hit-and-run graffiti that criticize others for the faults of your own side.

    Your latest attempt to justify your positions is a good case in point. I was clearly referring to those who run Gaza as well as those in charge of those bastions of progressive values of Syria, Iran and so many of Israel’s other neighbors who are (without question) the most racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary regimes on the face of the earth. These are your allies, these are your values, these are the behaviors you must project onto Israel (as you project your own ideologically-blinkered mind) onto Israel’s supporters.

    I appreciate that such behavior is required under the rules of Palestinian Hasbarah, and that any path would force you to confront your alliance with the forces of reaction would conflict with your self-image as being on the vanguard of progressivism and justice. But neither I nor Israel is required to pretend with you that your lies are truth just so you won’t have to face the truth about yourself.

  22. Anonymous October 24, 2010 at 5:29 am #

    Jon you are mentally masturbating and I suggest you do it on your time. I made a simple point about the supporters of BDS in the US and other western democracies. I am still waiting for your response.

  23. Anonymous October 24, 2010 at 6:30 am #

    “your lifelong commitment to Palestinian hasbara”. You are using big words you shouldn't be using again. My lifelong …? You have no idea who I am and what my decade long, let alone lifelong commitments are, so chill.

    “these are your values”. And how do you know what my values are? Or is it, as I stated above, that in your narrow, pathetic, Zionist mind anyone who criticizes israel and supports the BDS movement, is allied with Iran, Syria and other repressive regimes in the ME?

    “…your alliance with the forces of reaction”. Ditto above.

    Speaking of alliances, isn't it asshole apologists for Israel like you that line the halls of congress to push the Israel agenda? You know the AIPAC, ADL, and others that spend millions pushing the pro israel agenda, and more importantly, destroy any politician who dares criticize israel and our misguided policies towards Israel. And somehow I am aligned with the repressive regimes in the ME. Did it occur to you that the totally one-sided and biased US policy towards Israel has left a huge vacuum that the likes of Iran are fully exploiting to their advantage? And I am accused of being impervious to arguments and facts? Tell me Jon, since you are so unbiased, can Israel do anything wrong? The war of 1948 and ethnic cleansing of Palestinians, occupation, oppression, roadblocks, and last but certainly not least the totally illegal, immoral and unnecessary settlements and colonization of occupied land are acceptable to you? And I am projecting?

    Israel is clearly a foreign policy liability for the US. This has been very eloquently articulated by Walt and Mearsheimer and others. The US support
    for Israel is a forced policy that will blow up sooner or later because
    it is not based on any long term interest of the US in the region. It is precisely
    the stupid policy of the US in this conflict (thanks again to the Israel lobby in
    the US) that Iran has become so powerful and popular in the ME.

    Decent progressive Jews all over the world are fed up with israel's behavior
    and see the suicidal path it is on, but apologists like you simply dare not see
    the truth. I will take sites like ICAHD.org, Josephdana.com, mondoweiss,
    activestills, and so many others (JVP) over reactionary ones associated with
    the likes of Pam geller, Caroline glickman, and z street 8 days a week. Progressive voices and organizations all over of critical of israel and it's brutal policies. It is no longer about one fringe group or another or just about the decision to divest or not, it is about the world seeing first hand how Israel has no interest in peace (case in point the PM Bibi and FM settler/thug Lieberman) but in grabbing land and rendering a two state solution irrelevant. It is about doing what is right and human rights. And then when the BDS movement talks about a one state solution it is demonized and accused of wanting to destroy Israel.

    Next time you decide to spew out of the wrong hole, take some anti diarrhea medication, rest and use a butt plug.

  24. Anonymous October 24, 2010 at 6:36 pm #

    Thank you for clarifying these matters so well in your blog posts.

    To anonymous potty mouth child:

    1948 was a genocide attempt by the Arabs.

    “This will be a war of extermination”
    -Azzam Pasha, Secretary General of the Arab League, May 15,1948

    Their so-called “naqba” was merely that they failed in a real genocide attempt! They failed to create a true final “naqba” for the Jews. Over *that* they lament. (And *you* lament with them. Think about that. That's what you seek self-importance in.)

    A genocide attempt by the Arabs. So was 1967. So was 1973. And right now as well, if they thought they could succeed. So is the core value of the PLO and Hamas. One side hates, while the other wants to survive. The bulk of local Arabs came in mass in the 1920s & 30s as migrant labor from surrounding countries. The Pali “identity” was invented in 1967. And the only difference b/t an Arab Israeli citizen and a “Palestinian” is that in 1948, when the Arab authorities said “come to Jordan while our armies slaughter all the Jews (just like big Mo did), and you can return in a week or two to take their homes after corpse clearing,” the Pals agreed, while the Arab Israelis are those who stayed. Do a little learning, and not from your lefty brainwash sites.

    As someone here remarked to you, you “wink at genocide.” Yep. And you wink at hatred, because it comports with your lefty values.

    And Jon correctly called it “Your lifelong commitment to Palestinian Hasbarah, after all, leaves you impervious to any argument, any fact, anything at all that might contradict your eternally fixed political positions.”

    The lefty narrative is largely lies, kid.

    (And it's clear you are a kid, by the potty mouth toilet stuff – you don't yet understand that grownups just don't do that – because they don't think that way – but kids do.)

    Johnny

  25. Jon October 25, 2010 at 9:14 pm #

    Anon – Actually, you didn’t “make a simple point about BDS supporters in the US and other Western democracies” so much as you deliberately tried to befog the point I made that the major supporters for your argument come from Israel’s traditional foes who are also the world’s most prominent human rights abusers. It was because you didn’t like that response that you still seem to be waiting (for what I don’t know).

    Johnny – If it makes a difference, I don’t consider the anonymous graffitists who spray paint their irrelevancies here in the comment section (in lieu of actually responding to any arguments presented here in this blog) as cynical.

    As you can see from their tendency to accuse anyone who disagrees with them as being a “right winger,” they clearly consider themselves as representing some type of progressive and/or liberal values. Yet the fact that their political choices involve allying with the most racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary regimes on the face of the earth must no doubt create internal conflict.

    Thus the need to ever inflate the evil and demonic power of Israel and its friends, rather than face the fact that it is the “Friends of the Palestinian People” who are allied with some of the world’s wealthiest and most powerful nations which also happen to be the world’s worst human rights abusers. And thus the need to burst into a rage at those who point out these simple truths, even if this involves behaving like a potty-mouthed child in a public place.

  26. Anonymous October 25, 2010 at 10:46 pm #

    Jon your repeated argument is as follows: the vast majority of the support for the BDS movement comes from the Arab nations who are abusers of human rights. I could not agree with you more.

    What I have said and am still waiting for your response is :

    The BDS movement has many supporters in the US, Britain, France, Holland, Norway,… the list goes on. I was not aware that these states were the “most racist, sexist, homophobic, reactionary, totalitarian regimes on the face of the earth”. So the reality is that people in western democracies (that are not human rights abusers) support the movement. This seems to be a very hard pill for you to swallow (almost like Bibi saying the two infamous words of “two states”.

    If what you are trying to say is that a. many Arabs are in support of the BDS movement (which I totally agree with) and b. because these Arabs have governments that have a lousy human rights record, therefore all Arabs are the most racist, sexist, homophobic, and reactionary people on the face of the earth, then you have a problem with Arabs and that is called bigotry. Please do not confuse the average Arab with their governments.

    I, and all the supporters of the BDS movement that I know, are not “allied with some of the world’s wealthiest and most powerful nations which also happen to be the world’s worst human rights abusers.” as much as you would like us to be.

  27. Anonymous October 26, 2010 at 4:06 am #

    Good job controlling your potty mouth for a post.

    You enitrely skipped over the statement of intent by the head of the Arab League in 1948.

    It’s a problem for you, I understand, that the local Arabs’ “nakba” – disaster – was simply their failure to execute a bonafide genocide against the Jews.
    It’s a problem for you, because those you (and your European fellow believers also) ally with are the most illiberal and anti-human rights governments and societies on Earth, as Jon explained. This is the cause you are attempting to justify. And so, what you do is you wink at genocide. This is the character of your cause, when it is examined in the light.

    The Arab governments – whose character you acknowledge – produced big lies. Your cause is based on these big lies, which comport with the character of the governments that created them. Their demonization of Israel – via popularizing the fictive bizarre reality play about “Palestinians” and Israeli “aggression,” “evil,” and etc – is what your whole worldview rests on . (If you’re like many ardent anti-Israel lefties I’ve encountered, almost your whole life may rest on it.)
    These lies – which cover for their hate, intolerance, and their dreams of genocide – come from their character, which also produced their *human rights* values. And you now resonate with that spirit, those values, or you wouldn’t support it, nor find yourself in it’s joke of a claim to morality.

    This is you. You choose to cheer for genocide.

    At this time. You can change (I know you can – you’ve cleaned up verbally from yesterday, for example). But recognizing this will require you face that your cause is a lie.

    Johnny

  28. Anonymous October 27, 2010 at 1:19 am #

    Johnny you are delusional. I recommend deep psychotherapy.

  29. DrMike October 27, 2010 at 5:17 am #

    Ah yes, when unable to respond to facts, cast aspersions.

    Not only can you not effectively counter Azzam Pasha's statement, but let's also note that the leader of the Palestinians in 1947-8 was one Haj Amin al-Husseini– who after fleeing to Berlin during the war years, meeting with Hitler, recruiting Bosnian Muslims for the SS, broadcasting on Nazi radio, and planning an Auschwitz style death camp to be built near Nablus, returned to Palestine and organized attacks on Jewish towns and farms immediately after the UN endorsed the creation of a Jewish state (AND an Arab state) in Palestine. The same al-Husseini who formed the Palestinian “Nazi Scouts” in the 1930s. The same al-Husseini who said back in the 1920's “Those alien invaders, the Zionists, will be massacred to the last man. We want no progress, no prosperity. Nothing but the sword will decide the fate of this country.”
    Nah, by 1948 he was a real co-existence, “sit on the mountaintops together and sing kumbaya” kind of guy, right? No thought of genocidal intent there, right?
    By the way, how many Jews remained (after ethnic cleansing) alive in areas overrun by Arab armies in 1948? And how many Arabs remained alive in areas overrun by Israel in 1948? (answers: zero and 150,000, respectively).

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